Crazy idea about controllers

[stevenshepherd]

So this might be crazy, but would the following be possible:

Make an NES compatible controller where the select and start buttons are the same shape as A and B, and then just place them above A and B like with the SNES controller. Then one could program an NES game to realistically use those buttons for things other than pause or menus. For most games, start is reserved for pausing, and select if used at all is used to navigate menus or selecting 1P or 2P (which could be performed by up and down). If one wanted to program either of these buttons to do something more substantial, their placement on the traditional controller is less than ideal.

 

[Mihoshi20]

If you're going to do that, you may as-well just look into the power pad at that point and build a custom NES controller with SNES or Original XBox like button layout and still keep start and select functionality. With all the space you have within the UNROM-512 spec, I could see someone easily making some robust games with it.

 

[Kasumi]

The SNES controller is actually hardware compatible with the NES. (Obviously the ports are different shapes, but the wiring is the same and you can get an adapter.)

The NES can read the extra buttons too. So if you wanted to support this with hardware that already exists, you can. (Caveat: Start+Select on SNES is still in the place where start+select is on NES, but a setting in game could remap the buttons for the SNES controller.)

 

[stevenshepherd]

oh wow that is really cool! thanks

 

[Mihoshi20]

That actually is rather handy that it can also read the extra buttons too.

 

[Kasumi]

It works similar to the Four Score (which allows one to connect and use four controllers in an NES game). You just read $4016/$4017 more times to get the other buttons.

Reading more than 8 times when only a standard controller is connected will result in a "pressed" state for all other buttons (for official Nintendo controllers! It can technically vary). Since SNES only adds 4 buttons, you get whether those buttons are pressed or unpressed, then four "unpressed" buttons. (Again, for official controllers.) So one can decide whether an SNES controller is connected or not by reading an extra 8 times. (5 if you're in a hurry!) If you get all pressed, definitely not. If the last read is unpressed, maybe.

It could be a nonstandard controller, or it could also be a Four Score! You can disambiguate further with EVEN MORE READS because the Four Score identifies itself with a specific byte, while the SNES controller would return #$FF.

I actually don't know what happens when you plug in an SNES controller into a Four Score, but I'd imagine you lose access to the extra buttons if it's in four player mode.

 

[Mihoshi20]

Fascinating. Actually makes me want to experiment with it now. Hopefully I'll be able to find the time soon and go to local game shop and see if they sell NES and SNES extension cables to build an adapter and play around with it. See what happens if you use an snes controller with that controller tester cart that supports 4 controller inputs.

 

[vrbandwagon]

Fascinating. Actually makes me want to experiment with it now. Hopefully I'll be able to find the time soon and go to local game shop and see if they sell NES and SNES extension cables to build an adapter and play around with it. See what happens if you use an snes controller with that controller tester cart that supports 4 controller inputs.

Please report back with your findings, I would also be interested to know.

 

[darkhog]

Pretty cool idea. I wonder why no company made such controller back in the day, before SNES was released. I mean, if four score worked then it should get someone's head working about "what if we'd make a controller that has more buttons than normal and works similar to fourscore".

 

[Kasumi]

Hardware costs money to produce, and it's hard to get people to buy it. It's like how Sega Genesis/Mega Drive had controllers with 3 extra buttons, but very few games used them.

The four score came out pretty late in NES' life. But rather than seeing the four score and thinking, "We could get more buttons" they probably saw the four score and thought, "Wow, I'm not sure we can convince games to take advantage of hardware like this if an official Nintendo product barely did."